Discussion of organized religion, the existence of God(s), and theism in general

[slightlyoddguy]

This thread serves to provide as a discussion ground for any and all topics dealing with theism, particularly those directed at organized religion and the existence of God. Is any particular religion true? Is religion a necessity in a functioning society? How is "God" defined? Do arguments for the existence (or nonexistence) of God logically follow? These and related questions are the sort that will be addressed here.

Because of the broad scope of this topic and the potential sensitivity some might feel towards it, please adhere to these basic rules:

• No flaming. Criticism is expected and welcome; baseless attacks on members are not.
• Stay on-topic.The discussion at hand covers an enormous spectrum of often ambiguous thought -- clarity is essential and spam is unnecessary.
• No proselytizing (i.e., preaching or attempts at conversion). In order to maintain an open, intellectual arena for discourse, religious claims should not be asserted out of hand.

Keep in mind that the current specific topic being discussed does not need to be continually addressed until resolved or forgotten -- members are free to put forth new ideas, even in the midst of ongoing discussions. (One group of people might be discussing the validity of the ontological argument for the existence of God, for example, while another might be discussing the implications of teaching Intelligent Design in science classes.)

Traditionally, in Western thought, "God" is used in reference to the Abrahamic God (i.e., the omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient deity of Judaism, Islam, and Christianity). Note that my mentions of "God" are not limited to that character, and reference both the deistic and pantheistic God, as well as any deity associated with a monotheistic religion.

All members, regardless of age or education, are encouraged to participate.

Previous thread (began as a rant and digressed into a discussion on religion in general)

[Megadeus]

I'll start this off with an argument (for God's existance) that I once... heard?
It basically states that all of creation somehow managed to come together, and therefore, there must be a creator. It can also be said that it seems extremely unlikely to the highest degree that a series of cosmic coincidences and accidents managed to create the many detailed and amazing things of nature, such as DNA.

There's the first coin in the well.

[penguinzrock]

i <3 sky fairy lawl

But seriously, I believe that God created us all. If not him, who else? I'd just prefer not to believe that we were all one big chain reaction.

[Starlit Azure]

Wether there is a god or not nobody can deny one thing about religion. It has an akward and fascinsting way of bringing uncommon people with a common belief together to acheive great things.

[pancitmalabon]

This topic serve a broad opinon. For me, I was raised in a highly strict Roman Catholic family where god is in every essence of our lives. Yet, the trouble is since I am a child of science, I find it higly unlikely that some deity came and created us all. Even in today's world me have a lot of information that could point out that the creation of the world was not in the hand of the god. An example would be the worlds being created, temperature, gravity, etc. Most of the information needed to find to prove these theories are probably on google.To me god is something that I call on when I am alone and scared. Something to rely on and belive that I have strength inside, it's just the creation part that I find that god made hard to believe. God, I think is in all of us, the small part of ourself that help us give courage when we face danger. This could be supernatural since when we overcome our fears we could look back at everything we had done and say, " Whoa! I did that?"

[nitecreeper]

I was born into a religous family. Believed in god. Gave up on God. Embraced Atheism (if you can?).

Some things in life make people find religion. I just so happened to find something in life that nulled the existance of god in my eyes.

That and dinosaurs aren't in the bible. GGUNINSTALL to those prophets and apostles leaving out several billion years of their "god's work"

[Starlit Azure]

I'm raised Greek Orthodox, meaning long church services, yia yias pinching your cheeks randomly, and hairy greek men shouting at you in greek at a million miles a second.

I believe in god, but I'm a science geek(:p). I'm not saying that there is no god, but I partially believe in the old saying "God helps he who helps themselves"


Did god create the universe? I think so, but I dont think he held our hands till humanity. It was humans who made the leaps and bounds to get us where we are.

[slightlyoddguy]

I'll start this off with an argument (for God's existance) that I once... heard?

It basically states that all of creation somehow managed to come together, and therefore, there must be a creator.

Clarify "creation" and "managed to come together". As far as I can tell, those statements already presuppose to existence of a creator, and so the argument is begging the question.

It can also be said that it seems extremely unlikely to the highest degree that a series of cosmic coincidences and accidents managed to create the many detailed and amazing things of nature, such as DNA.

Again, clarify "coincidences", "accidents", and "many detailed and amazing things of nature".

But seriously, I believe that God created us all. If not him, who else? I'd just prefer not to believe that we were all one big chain reaction.

You have not demonstrated that a supernatural creator is necessary for or the most probable explanation for our existence. Compare your proposition with the equally ridiculous "But seriously, I believe that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created us all".

I believe in god, but I'm a science geek(:p).

You will be relieved to know, then, that Christianity (you're talking about the Christian deity, right?) provides a scientific hypothesis with which one can test its validity.

I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you." -- Matthew 17:20

Do you have have faith as small as a mustard seed? If so, you can conduct the experiment yourself. I would suggest levitating silverware.

[Lore]

i try to tie in logic with religon, which suprisingly if you think about it isnt that hard to do(never lost an argument with an evalutionist yet, though i do belive in certain forms of evalution, such as micro evalution- the adaption of a being overtime to its suroundings). and if i ever cant describe somthing with logic, there is always the mentality that, God can do anything.

[penguinzrock]

You have not demonstrated that a supernatural creator is necessary for or the most probable explanation for our existence. Compare your proposition with the equally ridiculous "But seriously, I believe that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created us all".

I didn't want to demonstrate anything. It's just a preference of mine to not believe in the realist ideas. Life is bleak as it is; religion is our only escape. Saying "We were all created in a huge explosion of matter no one can control, and in return are equally flying towards our inevitable doom." sounds a bit depressing, don'cha think?

Also, we as humans need some sort of something to lean on when things get tough. Who else can we turn to? Depression and despair close in all around us; it's all we can do, when we pray. I'm not trying to make it sound like religion is just some anti-depressant, but if we didn't have religion, what else? Who could have inspired Michaelangelo, Da Vinci, and other great Creationistic artists? Who could have turned Martin Luther into a believer, and ultimately stop the corruption of the Catholic priests? A higher presence must be there (or so man thinks).